Please disable any adblockers if the video is not showing below.

Osisko Gold Royalties

View Company Profile

September 16, 2024 at 1:20 PM (MDT)|Broadmoor Hotel & Resort

Jason Attew

President, CEO, & Director

Mr. Attew is a mining industry veteran who has dedicated more than 25 years to the mining sector. Prior to starting in his role as President & CEO of Osisko Gold Royalties, Jason had previously served as President, Chief Executive Officer and Director of Liberty Gold Corp and Gold Standard Ventures Corp as well was the Chief Financial Officer at Goldcorp Inc. where, in addition to leading the finance and investor relations operations, he was responsible for Goldcorp’s corporate development and strategy culminating in the US$32 billion merger with Newmont Corporation.

Mr. Attew has extensive international capital markets experience from his time in investment banking with the BMO Global Metals and Mining Group where he was at the forefront of structuring and raising significant growth capital as well as advising on both formative and transformational mergers and acquisitions for corporations that have become industry leaders over the past two decades. Jason is also on the board of directors of Evolution Mining. Jason holds a Master of Business Administration, Queen’s University and a Bachelor of Science (Honours), University of British Columbia.

This is an automatically generated transcript. Denver Gold Group cannot accept responsibility for mistakes, errors, omissions, or any action taken in reliance thereon. Use of this transcript is governed by Denver Gold Group’s Terms of Use.

Thank you for joining us today. Maybe I'll ask the same question that I kicked off with Nolan as well. How do you see the company in about 5 to 10 years time? Thanks Cosmo. And so firstly, for context, the company is a relatively new company. It's 10 years old now. It actually celebrated its 1010 year anniversary just a couple of months ago. I should have actually brought you a celebra celebratory one ounce coin. Of course, it would be silver given where gold price has gone. It probably affect your cost of goods sold. You can't, you can't put out too many of those. But look, I I'm a big believer in taking and doing a look back analysis. So the company is 10 years old. It was a product of a takeover defense as I think most people know in a spin out of a royalty company with a 5% NSR on the Canadian Malartic that Niko Eagle operates and arguably and, and, and, and this is well well known through, through, through the sector and that that 5% NSR is the best royalty out of gold royalty across the sector as well acknowledged for that. But going back and doing a, a 10 year look back analysis again, given my history and investment banking, I always look at returns. And so the return total return over the past 10 years has been roughly 70% which would impute a keg or 5.5 to 6%. And so, clearly w when, when the company was formulated, look, it's, it's not the returns that the other of our peers have, have produced over that 10 year period. And so I always like to look at mantra, you know, the Warren Buffett's, obviously, the oracle of investing always said it's good to learn from one's mistakes. However, it's much better to learn from other people's mistakes. And so had a lot of successes clearly through the 1st 10 years of a Cisco. but there was some mistakes made as well. And, and so my belief 5, 10 years from now is we can do much better in a return perspective, multiples of better and return perspective than that 70% over the past 10 years. And, and so how do we do that? Well, well, the first aspect cosmo is we are very much a keep it simple business. Now, all we're focused on is providing mine, finance and capital to high quality teams and high-quality jurisdictions with high quality assets, royalty streams and economic interests. and, and, and, and so we see the opportunity set to be very, very good. And so we're can con continue to keep the business very, very simple because it is a fantastic business model. This the second way again, when we do look back when we're sitting down here 5 to 10 years for from, from now is O OB obviously and, and, and Nolan said it said best as well. Again, our portfolio is so loaded with great optionality. If I were to sit in my hands over the next five years, we've got from this base point, we have 40 to 50% top-level revenue growth that we're very, very confident in. It's and so there's just that natural per progression that will obviously move down to the cash flow for for the company. But lastly, we're, we're not sitting on our hands. We want to be on the mind, financer of choice with our partners out there. And so we're active obviously looking at the opportunities, however, the lens that we now take is really around per share metrics. And, and so we have to, in order for us to do and have the discipline around a transaction, we have to look at per share metrics, specifically growth and cash flow per per per share. And I will tell you that we've also tweaked the compensation for the executive team and the management teams are really compensated based on that growth in cash flow per share because as as you know, you've done this for, for some time, there's a very strong correlation around relative out performance, share performance if you can grow your cash flow per share. And, and so that's what we're focused on. We're focused on for share metrics. E every single one of the executive has minimum shareholder requirements. So we're thinking like owners every day. And so hopefully, you know, in that 5 to 10 year period where we're sitting down again, we're, we've actually achieved returns that are multiple of the 1st 10 years. Thanks Jason. I'm very honored that everyone so far still wants to sit down with me in 5 to 10 years time. Hope you keep your promises. But maybe as you talked about, you know, there were some mistakes that were made in the past and one set back in 2024. I don't want to bring it up, but I think we should is Victoria Gold. O Cisco Gold royalties had to write down $68 million in impairment on the ego mine. However, based on pwc's latest assessment, who is the appointed receiver, it seems like Victoria Gold holds about $825 million in assets and about $300 million in debt. How does this information change? O Cisco Gold royalties? View on the situation at Victoria Gold and what does that mean potentially for the recovery of O Cisco Gold royalties investment? It's a great question cos so it doesn't change our view whatsoever. We, we took it a, a write down. It was a technical accounting write down based on the facts that we had at the day. We, we're still think that as a very viable asset. Obviously, the heat bleach failure was not a good thing for the industry. It wasn't a good thing for us and, and clearly, it, it, it created the insolvency such situation with Victoria. The lens that we had at the time though is we had very little visibility in terms of the operating plan to go forward operating plan, the go forward financing plan for Victoria itself. And therefore, we took a conservative decision to essentially write the asset down to zero for context. I mean, we did buy the royalty a number of years for 98 million. It paid back roughly two thirds of that. And, and we do believe that there's significant value going forward. It's, we, we obviously have the protections through. It is obviously a secured royalty is registered and title with, with, with the Yukon. So when it does get up and operating again, we certainly can just reverse that, that, that impairment that we put through. But right now, we just don't have any visibility as to when that's going to happen. PWC obviously has to run a process. There is as, as you're quite aware, there's a fair amount of debt in front, front of the company as well. 220 million of secured debt through some of our partners that are here through the various banks that supported the, the, the, the Eagle build as well. But we do see certainly good value. There's almost 3 million ounces of reserves there. We, we see value. It's just the timing and the uncertainty of the timing of the cash flows to come on that, that made that decision. But we feel very comfortable. We, we've got a secured interest in the asset and when it is up and going again, we'll, we'll start receiving cash flows of that 5% NSR Great. And then maybe turning to some of the positives as you mentioned and I do agree, Jason that the Canadian melodic royalty is if not the best one of the best royalties in our business. So maybe, could you give us an update? I think even in some of your latest presentations, you had talked about the potential of a second shaft and what that potential expansion could mean to o cisco gold royalties. Of course, Agnico Eagle is doing a lot of exploration around the area as well including upper beaver. Could you maybe help us understand the potential here in terms of what it means to or? Yeah, look, obviously, we have a ton of time and respect for the operator being unique legal and they've been quite successful based on two things that we're, we're, we, we will have success with as, as, as well. Firstly, the geopolitical risk, the low geopolitical risk portfolio that they have. But secondly, they're very focused on, on regional opportunities and, and the regional opportunity that you talk about with Canadian Malartic and the potential for the second shaft. Look, we, we, we think it's, it's, it's, it's something that Nico is a very conservative group. The fact that they're talking about a second shaft means that they're very confident from a technical acumen perspective. That's gonna come to reality. The fact of the matter is that you would know that the, the mine itself is transitioning from a low-grade bulk tonnage, open pit scenario to obviously a higher grade underground. And therefore there's opportunities to, to essentially, you know, with a higher grade underground to sink second step. But for, for us what that means and, and this is beyond 2028 where, where obviously the open pits deplete. But what that means with the second shaft, it means 15 to 20,000 gold equival ounces for, for our shareholders with no incremental capital costs associated. And so right now, you, you would, you would know and, and see that the life of mine that Nico has put out goes to 2042. So still significant life of mine, lots of opportunities to fill in the mill. Obviously, there's gonna be about 40,000 tons per day of latent capacity in that mill through some of the regional hubs or the re the regional assets that they, they, they do have. And, and so we're, we're quite excited about what Nijo can, can do go forward and again, it's going to be very important and accretive to, to our shareholders as, as they continue their efforts to fill the mill to look at 2nd, 2nd shaft. And,, and, and, and lastly what I would say, I mean, it's no accident that when, when, when we came on, we actually put David Smith on, on our board, David Smith, the people that art where is an 18 year veteran of Igne IEG, he ended his position last year as the CFO I call him Mr Malartic. And he, he believes that beyond 2042 it's got another couple decades. It's a very long life asset, very important, obviously to our company, very important to Quebec and the Canadian economy. And so we're quite excited to be partnered with Nico Eagle on that asset and talking about partnerships, I think in the previous fireside discussion or fireside chat. Nolan gave you a bit of advertising, talking about syndication. So let's talk about syndication on the Casco Bell project. It is the first time I've seen O Cisco Gold Royalties and Franka Nevada partner up and syndicate on the deal. Can you share with us more on how this happened? And what would you say is the biggest benefit for O Cisco gold royalties by doing the syndication. So, yeah, no, it's a great question. Obviously ourselves and Franco did put an investment into an asset in Ecuador called Casa be run by Soul Gold. And, and so how it was really originated as we both had exposure through royalties at the asset already. So we're quite familiar with the asset but also quite familiar with the challenges. I mean, mining is a very tough business. There's there's challenges and risks that that one needs to, to, to, to go through in order to get to the cash flow stage. So we had our eyes very wide open. It just seemed and, you know, given my history 16 years as an investment banker, I've been espousing this for many, many years, no one mentioned it before. Syndication is a really good concept in my mind in terms of spreading some of the the risk just around mining and that's not just geopolitical risk, it's technical risk as well. So there was a meeting of mines very quickly when we started about talking about, you know, providing significant capital to the the casket be asset. Now, the way we structured the transaction, I'll just speak from an a Cisco perspective. We've really put 10 million do dollars down today. This $10 million could I mean, it's a really good option, the way we consider it is a really good option which could convert when it's up and operating to 23 to 25,000 gold equivalent ounces for, for multiple generations. And, and so we, we will do those type of deals every day and twice on, on Sundays for, for, for sure. And, and so, and there's also plenty of off ramps too if, if we don't like, for example, what's going on in Ecuador at the time? Then there, there's an off ramp for us not to continue to fund it. So again, I think it was an eloquent way for us to get together with a senior. What it does for an A Cisco gold royalty shareholder is clearly the 750 million that was committed to the project we couldn't do on our loan. It's just too much concentration. Our, our revolver itself is 750. We've almost got it paid down to zero. So essentially we'd be out of the business of providing mind finance if we, if we did that alone. So it allows us to actually get into world class assets with a partner like like Franco and get exposure to it. So again, absolutely advocate and I'm using that transaction to, to essentially talk to the rest of our peers of how we can actually work together on similar type deals. I'll survey the room for any questions. Ok, I'll continue. So, you know, we talk about growth and what are the key growth projects windfall O Cisco mining, O Cisco mining is now being acquired by gold fields. Gold fields will own 100% of the asset. How do you think this could potentially impact of cisco gold royalties? So it doesn't have because what it doesn't have a huge impact, we always believed in the asset. What it does do is a huge endorsement by Goldfields to pay a very, very significant premium for an asset, high, very high grade, if not the highest grade Quebec underground asset that will be developed over, over over time. So it's just a an endorsement or a vote of confidence that y you know that they're obviously very focused on it. It would be very material for, for, for Goldfields, it's now consolidated ownership structure too or will be when the, when the transaction close. So net net is all very much positive. However, from an economic perspective for Cisco gold royalties and I think it's just a really good endorsement by, by a senior gold producer that wants to come in and be an important player in Quebec and will be the benefactor from that great Jason. Maybe, you know, putting it all together. Your current fiveyear guidance is to grow to 100 and 2200 and 35,000 G OS by 2028. When you came on board last year, you had a fresh pair of eyes, you reset the sort of baseline for it, I guess my question this year today is how much of that growth that we just talked about? Second shaft Canadian Malartic or you know, we didn't talk about Mantos Blanco, but how much of that potential expansion has been factored in? TZ is now you know, starting production, upper beaver. We kind of touched on how much have you factored into your fiveyear growth guidance. So, what I would say is again that 40 to 50% growth from the base of as of today, we we as a team when I started, we, we did a whole portfolio review and we, we actually took a look at every one of the assets to teared through the technical reports and came up with their own probabilistic assessment as to what these, each of these assets can do. What I would say though, in terms of that growth, it's very high quality in terms of the operators, there's really only one or two, there's mar marginal or single asset companies that don't have the financial breadth. And the, for example, we just talked about windfall. That's part of our, our 55 year outlook, but that's the goldfields, that's gonna be obviously moving that forward. Another example is we have a a royalty in Hermosa which is South 30 two's asset in Arizona, which will be a big part of that growth trajectory. Obviously getting to that 120 to 135. It's not going to be in a straight line. The biggest step change for us is actually next year and that has to do with Mantos Blancos. Mantos Blancos is on a journey to essentially get to 20,000 tons per day at their operation. The, the expansion hasn't gone as well as they, they, they had hoped. But we do see that actually coming, coming as a, as a bene benefactor to, to our company in, in 2025. And that's a big, big step change. Plus we're going in 2025 we're going to get a full year of the copper stream that we have with our partners at mental acquisition, A Corp operating the, the CS Ami and New South Wales Australia. Plus we get, as you mentioned, a full year of Toco Andino, which is the asset in Brazil. The G mining's done a formidable job of getting up and going in just under a couple of years. And we're also gonna be receiving a full year of, we have an asset in Ghana called Nandini. So we, we, the, the growth is again, not straight line, but we're again un underpinning that we're very confident that, that we're gonna get to that five year outlook of 120 to 135 over time. It's great to hear. Maybe one other question here in terms of capital allocation. How should or how do you rank, you know, the different sources of capital allocation, be it acquisitions for growth, dividend, increases, share buybacks, you don't have a lot of debt to repay. So maybe that's not part of it. And maybe in that context, if you can talk about, you know, the the environment, the marketplace out there for acquisitions. So I I would say when I first joined, we were fo focused on a deleveraging. I mean, when I first joined, our net debt was close to 300 million. We've now got it down to 30 as of today. So, and we have a, as I mentioned, a revolving facility of 700 fif fif 50 million. So then you go through kind of the capital allocation decision tree. And clearly, we're, we're, we want to be very active and, and do transactions that actually have an impact within our five year outlook. So that means cash flowing opportunities today or something that's very near cash flowing. a development, an advanced development project that we, we, we have a lot of confidence. And so f from, from a priority perspective, again, we, we paid down our, our debt to where we're comfortable, we can reload and start actually looking at and, and deploying in, in, in acquisitions. And these could be anywhere between 50 million us to, you know, 400 million us. We've got that, that opportunity set. We, we do pay a dividend and we did actually increase our, our dividend by 8% a a AAA couple of quarters ago or a quarter ago ago. And, and that was really based on the predictability and consistency that we see of our, of our business go forward. And, and so kind of rule of thumb, we, we will pay out 30% of our operating cash flow. So as you think about the, the growth profile that I just mentioned, if we did no other transactions, you can expect that the dividend will be increased and go forward. Then we have as a tool as, as Nolan mentioned, we do have regulatory approval around a buyback program. So we, we, we can be and we will be active on, on buybacks because again, it very much feeds into the theme or the thesis that we think on per share basis. So if we can get more concentration for our shareholders in Malartic and Mantos Blancos and CS A by buying shares back at the right price, we, we, we absolutely will do that. The last thing that that you asked about is just the opportunity set. And so I I would say the opportunity set is just exceptional right now. And and why that is, I mean, we're at the Denver Gold Farm or the, the Gold Farm Americas and there's obviously all different sizes of companies here. But if you think of the lower end of the companies that have some very high quality development assets. The the the capital markets still is not that constructive for them. And I'm thinking the equity and the debt, debt capital markets for, for, for good quality companies to, to essentially fund fund, fund their programs. And even with the commodity complex that we, we're at right now, there, there's still a dislocation for some of these high quality opportunities. So we will be we're, we're obviously very advanced in, in some of those discussions and, and we hope and the instructions that I've given to the team, if we can get one, maybe two transactions done around the, the, the strike zone that, that I mentioned earlier every 12 to 18 months. Then I think we've been doing our job, but it's got to be above our hurdle rate. It's gotta be above our cost of capital. It's gotta be a good spread acro across our cost of capital. because that's the only way again, we're gonna make, do a creative deals and, and, and make money for shareholders because I, as I like to say, we're, we're really as a Cisco Gold Royalties management. We're really risk managers on behalf on behalf of the shareholders capital. Thank you, Jason. I was gonna say you're dating yourself by calling this a Denver Gold Forum, but that's all the time we have. And thanks for joining us today.


NOTICE

The Denver Gold Group does not make any express or implied condition, representation, warranty or other term as to the accuracy, validity, reliability, timeliness or completeness of any information or materials in general or in connection with any particular use or purpose presented at the Gold Forum. Denver Gold Group cannot accept responsibility for sourcing variances, mistakes, errors or omissions or for any action taken in reliance thereon. Use of this data is governed by Denver Gold Group's Terms of Use.

The Denver Gold Group does not represent or endorse the accuracy or reliability of any third party advice, opinion, statement, information or materials received during the Gold Forum.

INVESTMENT ADVICE - NO OFFER OR RECOMMENDATION

The Gold Forum and the information and materials presented at the Gold Forum do not, and shall not be construed as, making any recommendation or providing any investment or other advice with respect to the purchase, sale or other disposition of any regulated gold related products or any other regulated products, securities or investments, including, without limitation, any advice to the effect that any gold related transaction is appropriate or suitable for any investment objective or financial situation of a prospective investor. A decision to invest in any regulated gold related products or any other regulated products, securities or investments should not be made in reliance on any of the information or materials presented or obtained during the Gold Forum. Before making any investment decision, prospective investors should seek advice from their financial, legal, tax and accounting advisers, take into account their individual financial needs and circumstances and carefully consider the risks associated with such investment decision.